[TESTING] Damage Formulas

[Taicho-Senpai]

Anyone know the exact damage formulas for normal attacks, skills, etc? If not, then here's what I've come up with.

Testing: How much actual damage output does +Attack points give you?

Controlled Variables:
• Testing on Ittanmomen
• Using same exact Hakuda's (twin swords) for each test

Manipulated Variables:
• Number of magatamas (will only be using Mushirou mag's, which add +200atk points each)

Test #1 -
Using:
• Non elemental Hakuda's
• No magatamas at all
• Just regular hits (no skills), only counting the yellow numbers (there are yellow, orange and red, the red numbers are the crits obv.)
• 1,029 atk (Status window)

Regular hits:
170
173
171
171
171
172
172
171
170
172
Total dmg: 1713
Avg: 171.3


Test #2 -
Using:
• Non elemental Hakuda's (Same as test #1's)
• x1 Mushirou Magatama
• Just regular hits, no skills
• 1,229 atk (Status window)

Regular hits:
206
206
206
207
206
208
208
206
207
206
Total dmg: 2066
Avg: 206.6

Notes:
206.6 - 171.3 = 35.3
35.3 / 200 = 0.1765


Test #3
Using:
• Non elemental Hakuda's (Same as test's #1 and 2)
• x2 Mushirou Magatama's
• Just regular hits, no skills
• 1,429 atk (Status window)

Regular hits:
243
241
243
243
241
242
243
242
243
243
Total dmg: 2,424
Avg: 242.4

Notes:
242.4 - 206.6 = 35.8
35.8 / 200 = 0.179

Calibrating average of all three test calculations:
0.179 + 0.1765 = 0.3355
0.3355 / 2 = 0.17775

Conclusion: Each attack point averages to about 0.17775 to actual output dmg.

• (Example) - Status window says you have 400atk but you have on a 50~100atk wep. so realistically your status window should say you have 350-400atk.
• Formula for actual output dmg (given you have no elemental dmg modifiers on and your weapon has no basic combo +X%):
(400) x (0.17775) = 71.1
Therefore, each (yellow) normal hit will average out to about 71.1

Little "here and there" notes:

• Each elemental point = 1% + x%(skill)
Ex.) You have Fireball II with a skill force of 200 which means it's a 200% modifier.
You come across a wand with Fire Element +10, which means it'll add +10% to fire elemental skills.
Therefore, your Fireball II will say it does 200 skill force but with the fire elemental 10 it'll actually do 210 skill force. (Confirmed by CuppyCakey)

• I hypothesize that the numbers at the right of the elementals under the "Allocate" button on your status window with the weapons next to it is your "Weapon Affinity".

• [TESTING] Skill force = damage modifier.
Ex.) A skill with 152 skill force = 152% damage modifier. Let's say you realistically have 350-400atk and you have about 200 affinity with the weapon. You use a skill, given it's a non elemental skill and you aren't using any weps or mags with elementals. Then the formula would be:
152%(350~400) + (200 / 2)
(Skill % Dmg) + (Wep affinity divided by 2) =
152% of 350 = 532 + 350 = 882
152% of 400 = 608 + 400 = 1,008
882 + 100 = 982
1,008 + 100 = 1,108
Therefore, the skill would do about 982~1,108 damage.

• The ranking of skills in general (not via Momotarou) depend on the amount of uses, e.g. I had to use the skill 16 times to get the skill from lv.10 to lv.11.
Skill - Crimson Crosscut II
lv.10 ~ lv.11 = 16 uses
lv.11 ~ lv.12 = 18 uses
lv.12 ~ lv.13 = 20 uses
lv.13 ~ lv.14 = 22 uses
lv.14 ~ lv.15 = 24 uses
lv.15 ~ lv.16 = 26 uses
As you can see, the amount of skill uses rise by two every level. I still need to test whether the amount of uses is the same for every skill.


P.S. - I'm not a mathematician, just someone wanting to contribute. So if you see something wrong in my formulas or have data of your own feel free to post, I would love to hear about it. I'll be adding more data when I come across any. kthxbai.

[Ryxa]

I've got a request of you:

Do you mind using the same weapons (Hakuda) and testing your damage on other mobs and comparing that damage to what you have now? I'm curious whether level of the mob plays into your damage, if difficulty scaling of dungeons do, or if there are any other variables that affect your damage (Such as the possiblity that each mob as their own base defense numbers against physical and magical). One issue with your testing is that if any of the above are true, there's a lot more testing to be done. It's a good start though since I haven't seen anyone else do much damage testing with actual numbers.

[Taicho-Senpai]

I've got a request of you:

Do you mind using the same weapons (Hakuda) and testing your damage on other mobs and comparing that damage to what you have now? I'm curious whether level of the mob plays into your damage, if difficulty scaling of dungeons do, or if there are any other variables that affect your damage (Such as the possiblity that each mob as their own base defense numbers against physical and magical).

I should be able to do it tomorrow since my schedule isn't as tight that day.

One issue with your testing is that if any of the above are true, there's a lot more testing to be done.

Most definitely, I'm also looking for ways to calculate monster p.def and m.def, and how "Weak, Very Weak, Bit Strong, Strong, and Very Strong" to elementals can be put into numbers. But anywho, thanks for the feedback.

[Ryxa]

You just happened to be experimenting with someone the wiki people were about to start messing with xD No need to thank for the feedback. I should be thanking you for getting this work started.

[CuppyCakey]

I can confirm that every point of elemental affinity equals to +1% in damage on a skill with the same element. I tested with flame strike 3 with 0 elemental affinity on gloom darumas and got 3400 - 3600 damage. Equipped a +20 fire element matagama and got 4100 - 4300 damage. Dividing the average damage would give you 4200/3500 = 1.2 which is a 20% increase in damage for +20 fire elemental affinity.

Skill force however, as I mentioned in another thread does not directly equate to damage. In general it does but not in a way we might think it does. I have seen some skills with lower skill force do higher damage then skills with lower skill force and most of the time the increase in skill force is not a direct constant increase to damage in a form of a multiplier, or it has a much more complicated formula. For example, I tested dark pillar III with skill force 212 and flamestrike III with skill force 232, same weapon equipped, 0 elemental affinities and no matagamas. Test dummies were grass stickies while had no strength or weakness towards both the dark and fire element. I did an average of 2000 damage with dark pillar III and about 2500 with flamestrike III. 2500/2000 x 100% = 20% difference in damage where as difference in skill force percentage is only 232/212 x 100% = 9.5%. Note that flamestrike III is level 29 while darkness pillar III is level 7, which may then again point to a something I mentioned earlier about skill info not updating properly ( such as SP cost of skills shown ).

I don't have time to test things out or even play the game ATM. Just putting my observations out there so someone else can confirm/test it.

[Taicho-Senpai]

I can confirm that every point of elemental affinity equals to +1% in damage on a skill with the same element.

Cool beans, thanks for the confirmation.

Skill force however, as I mentioned in another thread does not directly equate to damage. In general it does but not in a way we might think it does. I have seen some skills with lower skill force do higher damage then skills with lower skill force and most of the time the increase in skill force is not a direct constant increase to damage in a form of a multiplier, or it has a much more complicated formula.

Mmm, if you ever get the chance or have the time, I would love to know the attack range of the weapon and the total amount of weapon attack that showed on your status window was when you were testing this, unless you lvl'd up, threw away the exact weapon, etc. Thanks alot for the info, I'll be sure to make good use of it and continue testing this pesky "Skill Force" formula (hopefully it even has one).

[CuppyCakey]

Fortunately I haven't logged in or changed anything since that test a week ago. Busy with my finals now but wouldn't hurt to login for a screenshot.

[Taicho-Senpai]

Fortunately I haven't logged in or changed anything since that test a week ago. Busy with my finals now but wouldn't hurt to login for a screenshot.

Ah, thank you very much for taking the time to log in for the screenshot. Also, after taking the info and putting it in my formula, here's what I got:

Variable A - You included the 8% and 5% skill force into your calculations:
lv.7 Dark Pillar III - 212%
Claimed Avg: 2,000dmg
212%(417~474) + (354) =
1655.04 ~ 1832.88
Seeing as the max dmg for this formula is 1832 and your claimed average is 2000, if you did include the skill force shown on your wand into your calculations then my formula is most likely wrong and I need to think of something else.

Variable B - You forgot to include skill force into your calculations. If so, then my formula meets your claimed Dark Pillar average damage circumstance, and I see two ways of calculating it.
Calculation 1:
lv.7 Dark Pillar III - 212%, 8%, 5%
Claimed Avg: 2,000dmg
212%(417~474) + 8%(417~474) + 5%(417~474) + (354) =
1,829.37936 ~ 2,031.04992dmg
This calculation meets the circumstance of a 2,000dmg average.

Calculation 2:
lv.7 Dark Pillar III - 212%, 13%
Claimed Avg: 2,000dmg
212%(417~474) + 13%(417~474) + (354)
1824.1752 ~ 2,025.1344
This calculation also meets the circumstances of a 2,000dmg average.


Now for flame strike, same variables, just different numbers.

Variable A - You included the 8% and 5% skill force into your calculations:
lv.29 Flamestrike III - 232%
Claimed Avg: 2,500
232%(417~474) + (354) =
1738.44 ~ 1927.68

Variable B - You forgot to include skill force into your calculations. Two ways of calculating it.
Calculation 1:
lv.29 Flamestrike III - 232%, 8%, 5%
Claimed Avg: 2,500
232%(417~474) + 8%(417~474) + 5%(417~474) + (354) =
1923.95496 ~ 2138.55312

Calculation 2:
lv.29 Flamestrike III - 232%, 13%
Claimed Avg: 2,500
232%(417~474) + 13%(417~474) + (354) =
1918.4172 ~ 2132.2584

Well, as you can see, my formula for Flamestrike isn't even coming close to your claimed average of 2,500. So either my formula is completely wrong or you, with all due respect, miscalculated somewhere/rounded(no offense intended sir/mam'). Nevertheless, thank you very much for your efforts, I will continue to research into this.

[CuppyCakey]

There's also the possibility that your formula may be correct but the numbers in the game itself isn't updated properly (not sure if the +skillforce on the wand changes the numbers shown in the skill list). An example would be the effect of WIS on skills viewtopic.php?f=10&t=2488 - 4th post, as there may be other variables that change skill force, damage, etc but the changes are not shown on the description ingame. Could you test is skill level has any correlation to damage as well or if its solely just for skill evolution?

[Taicho-Senpai]

Could you test is skill level has any correlation to damage as well or if its solely just for skill evolution?

Test #3: Skill force = damage?

• Skill - Lightning Slash IV
• Tested on: Kijimuna (No particular weakness to lightning)
• Testing area: Outside of Underground Caverns
• Controlled variables: Same exact weapon, same monster, no magas, no ele affinity.
• Recording the orange numbers due to them being more abundant.

lv.5 = 99 skill force
Orange:
601
599
602
597
Total damage: 2399
Average: 599.7

lv.6 = 101 skill force
Orange:
615
607
609
616
Total damage: 2447
Average: 611.75

lv.7 = 103 skill force
Orange:
621
624
626
620
Total damage: 2491
Average: 622.75