SkillForce, CritForce, Element And Damage

[Q6int]

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[SupremeTentacle]

I like the general idea of what you've done here. I've got a few suggestions and whatnot. Might sound a bit harsh, but that's not my intention.

But before I get into that... I'm going to have to say that unfortunately, its very inaccurate because you've based it off sekigahara monsters. As a result, I think that instead of flat out calculating damage numbers, you should calculate the player's damage multiplier instead.

Unless you can find out the enemies exact defense, I also suggest ignoring the effect of attack, since you're assuming everything does neutral elemental damage anyways.

Allow the player to change the 70/30 to the respective % of their skill.

Why does your base dmg include crit force? I don't really understand what you're trying to make this number represent.

Are you sure SF is scales based off your level and mob level? It seems like its only because of the defense.

Are you sure your _cfXrate and sfXrate, etc, are not just due to damage randomization?

Your crit force > element > sf is only under specific assumptions, so saying its like that in the general case is incorrect. It may seem that way because of diminishing returns, since you already have a bunch of SF and element. Under the assumption a skill is 70% element, and you have none of any of these stats:
1 Element provides 0.7 * 1 = 0.7% dmg
1 SF provies 1% dmg
1 Crit force 171/170 *100% = 0.59% dmg

[Q6int]

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[SupremeTentacle]

Going to be lazy, so I'm just going to reply inside the quote. Since you used bold, I'm going to use both bold and underline.

IKR , its not accurate cuz the goal wasn't to calculate the damage ,i only wanted to see by changing the dmg factors my final damage will increase or decrease (a relative number was enough to show me that)

Isn't that why a multiplier would suit this especially well? Say for example, you have +50 SF, the calculator would spit out 1.5x dmg. If you had a skill that was 100% composed of 1 element, and you had 50 of that element, as well as the 50% sf, it would spit out 2.25x

This way is more precise, and gives you a better idea of how much your real damage will increase, as you will probably know how much damage you currently do. However, it can't take changes to the attack stat into account because the effect of defense, assuming what you said about defense ignore is correct. You can make this even easier by making another field and putting (newdmg-olddmg)/olddmg *100%, and calling that the change in damage. Note that these are both multipliers, so its spot on accurate. If we stick the previous example into this formula, we get

2.25-1.5/1.5 = .75/1.5 = 0.5 * 100% = 50%

This is exactly what's expected, because the player exhibits a 50% increase in damage.

lemme explain how did i get the results cuz my answers is based on that ,and if my base tests was wrong, my answers will have wrong base.

pre notes:
I'm calculating Critical Hit Damage :
thanks to Fierce God Focus skill u can make sure that u gonna have crit hit, that's why i have critforce factor on my BaseDamage cuz im doing critical hit , i have nothing to do with normal damage here

This confuses me even more then. If base is still a crit, why is the difference so big between base and max? Only axe will have that big of a damage range under normal conditions.

mobs defense factor :
not considered , when ur lvl and target mob lvl have enough difference its not considered , u can try to hit an lvl 40+ kappa at seki and see ur damage and try to hit an lvl 4 kappa at kigahara and see ur damage they are gonna be same


EDIT: No, you're wrong about this. My oni dagger hits 1.2k on kikaigahara kappa, but only 1k on sekigahara kappa.

Is my damage depends on random factor :
no, ur base normal damage dose not depend on any random factor

There is definately randomization, as you can hit within a very large damage range. For example, my axe can hit like 400k-600k on the same monster. Note that these monsters are always attacked from the front, so rear attack, etc does not actually get taken into account.

ofc it depends on many factors eg when u hit mob while u standing at behind of it ur hit gonna be crit and etc...
u can test ur damage by using a long range skill like charge shot and standing exact the same angel from mob for each hit (u can stand behind the mob far way till ur skill range allows) and u gonna get the same damage each time

I don't know about ranged attacks, but melee attacks don't get any bonuses for hitting enemies in the back. (specifically basic attacks). This bonus is only activated when the player uses back strike; I tested this a few weeks ago when HP recovery was mistranslated as rear attack in our server.

now my tests at seki :
i removed all mags and accessories and equip Oni Dagger with Blue Blade Fang V skill
BlueBladeFang is a single combo skill and its gonna hit target by its full effect (using multi combo skills and ougis that have 50% range of effect and other options gonna have different story)
testing on musha that is indifference to wind element (wind is booster element of blueFang skill)
with no SkillForce, no element and no crit force, only ur affinity and wep attack (and status):

Crit Force X Rate:

Code: Select all

Damage = Attack * SkillForce * _sfXrate * CritForce * _cfXrate;

used my Fierce God Focus and while i standing behind of mob i hit i noted my damage
used amara (rnkVI+ while my blueFang is rnkV)mag with only 2x CritForce and hit
in two hit SkillForce didn't change u can get _cfXrate.
What I mean is that there is some variance in your attack stat. The window only shows your max attack stat, but your min attack stat is actually there as well. Oni dagger makes this seem more accurate than it is because it has such a small damage range. Hence, the small multipliers you're seeing are probably just different rolls within your damage range. I don't really understand how you're arriving at sfXrate and cfXrate if you are already accounting for this slight randomness in the rolls. Since no weapons have equal min and max attack, some randomness will always exist and throw off the calculations. Hence, I think that these numbers are probably just due to that.

This is assuming that I'm fully understanding what you're saying, but in this case, I'm not sure that I am, because it doesn't make sense.

SkillForce X Rate:

Code: Select all

Damage = Attack * [SkillForce + (SkillForce * magamataPercent/100)] * _sfXrate * CritForce * _cfXrate

run same test as critForce and get _sfXrate.

now i have _sfXrate and _cfXrate
i tried to change skillforce and critforce and calculate the damage before hit to make sure that i have approximately accurate xRates for current test environment.

Element X Rate :
i put a def mag with wind element and again FierceGodFocus And Hit

Code: Select all

BaseDamage = Attack * [SkillForce + (SkillForce * magamataPercent/100)]* _sfXrate * CritForce * _cfXrate
ElementDMG = BaseDamage * (ElementCoun /100) * _eleXrate
Damage = BaseDamage + ElementDMG


and puting some random mag and tried to calculate my damage by having _Xrates.

Test Environment :
Critical Hit
Single Combo Skill
Indifference Mob to Skill element
low lvl mob with no defense factor in compare to my lvl
same location in each hit from the target mob

before answering any question , did i forgot to consider any effective factor here ?
can i have some explanation about :

1 Element provides 0.7 * 1 = 0.7% dmg
1 SF provies 1% dmg
1 Crit force 171/170 *100% = 0.59% dmg

It's exactly what it sounds like.

If you put on 40% skill force, your damage will increase by 40% if you don't have any skill force yet. This is because the player's skills deal 100% damage by default, and adding 40 will lead them to do 140% damage.

If you put on 40 element, your damage will also increase by 40% if you don't have any element on yet, assuming the skill is 100% of that element. However, since most skills are 70% of the main element, you get 28% damage up because 0.7 * 40% = 28%.

However, since the player always has 170 innate crit force, you have to take that into consideration. Hence, if you put on 40 crit force, your total crit force is 210. This means that your critical damage has increased by (210-170)/170 * 100% = 23.53%

I think you should have just stuck to the conventional way of calculating your % change in damage instead of trying to take attack into consideration and getting real values. We already knew how to accurately calculate these relative changes in damage since a long time ago, so yeah.

[Q6int]

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[SupremeTentacle]

Edit: I'm just going to make a new thread for this.