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Fix the Healer Class

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Re: Fix the Healer Class

Postby Argentum » 28 Jul 2014, 19:15

Rebecca wrote:Are you telling me supports are this much harder to play even with so many benefits?


supports play simply different from other games. targeting mechanics and skills bound to 4 weaponslots and continuosly changing skillbinds (due to swapping to higher level weapons) are making supporting artificially harder.
while having the long range is a major benefit, its overshadowed by the 1-2 targeting mechanic once you have a group consisting of more then 2 people (and 3 leechers).

and for reasons like this i dare say a priest in WoW was never as hard to play as a support in this game is currently. the lack of challenging content that you still can affect is the difference between both games. (in onigiri supports are more a quality of life thing instead of a requirement, which may or may not be a good thing depending on your point of view)
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Re: Fix the Healer Class

Postby meep » 28 Jul 2014, 20:25

I keep seeing this issue about targeting
It's ridiculous
Learn to position yourselves people
Assign the role of lurer to one person
Cast energy balls in suitable locations for the damage dealers
Lock on to the lurer
Dealers on standby
Lurer initiates with a skill
Dealers follow suit

Damage dealers can pull out when necessary and go for energy balls or to you, the suport for heals
Meanwhile your first priority being the lurer, you will heal that person first

When it comes to dealing with mobs that are hard to lure, It's up to YOU to move your ass to the side when necessary, cause duh, staying in the back will ensure the closest party members will be targeted
Also, try to maybe aim at the member you want to lock on to, provided your view isn't blocked or that member too far

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Re: Fix the Healer Class

Postby meep » 28 Jul 2014, 20:30

By the way, having 4 weapons to switch skills between?
Think it's making your game harder?
Laughable

It only means you get to use more skills
Cycling cooldowns have never been easier
You can goddamn stack skills on a weapon

Please.
No really.
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Re: Fix the Healer Class

Postby Ozzy » 28 Jul 2014, 21:29

Alright so I see that many people have a number of conflicting ideas about support in general so I'd like to express my views based in my own observations and experiences in the hopes that it can clear things up alittle. For starters I would like to say that a support role is very important and It would be nice to be seen as more than a SP and speed buff monkey. I'm a person with feelings and while I don't want endless praise and admiration It would be nice to see some respect despite the lower damage support tend to have. (Its not our job to do damage just to help others do their damage faster, safer, and hopefully better.)

First: Damage, skill force, and affinity MOST DEFINITELY increase the usefulness for all of your skills including your heals and invigorate. (Most buffs don't actually get better with increases to you damage, skill force, and affinity they simply do their thing and make people happy but hey do require you have a minimum amount of these to be cast with 100% success rate.) To clarify, damage won't make your skills do a massive amount more, especially at lower levels, at higher levels it helps more because you have met the higher thresholds for better increases. For example past a certain threshold (I forgot what it is,) every +1k damage seems to increase invigorate by 1. On a similar note, skill force is simply a % multiplier based damage as well. If you have a higher level staff with high damage and skill force you will notice a big boost in the effectiveness in your skill particularly healing. Affinity doesn't directly affect skills it just makes damage better and therefore the effectiveness of your skills are boosted this goes for your mind as well by the way.

Second: Healers have a few things that are less then perfect but for the most part its pretty good. The targeting is sometimes annoying and enjoys watching me heal 4k to someone with full health while the person who would die if you sneeze too hard near them remains in their death-like state. Despite what I would like to say this is mostly my fault rather than the game's targeting system, if done correctly the targeting system works pretty good. For example putting your cross air on your dying buddy and meeting him halfway works great for accurately supporting and spreading your hope. It does everyone little good if we simply wait in the back of a room waiting for people to kill stuff for us and then walk to us for some love.

Third: Sick of my post yet? I sure am, but the show must go on! I would personally recommend that people, regardless of class, stick to their jobs. For example if you want to do damage go do that and may god bless you because all support people need your damage but if one day you decide you want to do some support too then you'll probably end up having to sacrifice some of your damage to meet the requirements needed to use support buffs. This is kind of a shame because there is already a class that has from level one sacrificed their attack to help out our damage dealing buddies so having a damage class do the same is a waste. (This is mostly aimed at the people who were brilliantly building their damage and then suddenly started building mind stat so that they could support too, don't let a pure supporter's sacrifice go to waste.) I don't want to tell anyone how to play as its not my place to do so but I think if people focused on there class's job I think people would all do better.

Fourth: Almost done I promise, I mostly just wanted to address the exp and lucky box issues that were brought up. While more exp would be great a pure healer is still dependent on the skill of the damage carry during a grind and even though we may be doing more than other leechers we're still not the carry. Likewise I would love more lucky boxes but again our job is to selflessly support our parties not our stash of money and goodies and therefore we need to focus on our support and not our lack of pretty boxes.

Well.... we're all bored of me now, I know that I find myself boring and lame right now. Actually that's it... We're finally done! If anyone has any questions or comments I'd love to hear them. (I promise I won't hurt you and even if I wanted to I don't do damage seeing as that isn't my job.) Some of this information may not be completely true because unfortunately I'm not an all-knowing god and I can't possibly test everything so if anyone can add something that would be great.

IGN: Ozzy (This was my name in the alpha, beta, and official release.)
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Re: Fix the Healer Class

Postby Ozzy » 28 Jul 2014, 21:40

meep wrote:Well Ozzy you are positive and I like you
Jesus :D

I'm flattered and equally surprised that you weren't bored to tears by my rambling thanks a bunch if you ever see my running around feel free to say hi. :D
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Re: Fix the Healer Class

Postby meep » 28 Jul 2014, 21:41

Well Ozzy you are positive and I like you
Jesus :D
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Re: Fix the Healer Class

Postby Lynneth » 28 Jul 2014, 22:28

meep wrote:As for the whole xp issue and lucky box thing
You still get full drops and ryou
Support is not hard to play in this game, though initially it is a rough start, the only real obstacle is sp
Leveling raises max sp cap, choosing kind gives high mnd and wis bonuses, and both these stats raise sp recovery while wis will reduce spell costs each ten points


Actually playing support is very easy in this game, yet there are some issues that needed to be addressed with. You need to adapt and learn much more than if you play sword/spear and bows. Once you adapt to the targeting system, selflessly only get 1/3 XP, selflessly only get ryou and drops, without lucky boxes of course, if you're fully support the party (no attacking), then you're good to go.
I find the drops of lucky boxes is very useful even if it drops Friendship Komainu. Here are the benefits of 'lucky boxes' :

1.Friendship Komainu = can be used to greatly increase the relationship with your partners. Or if you already have lots of these kind of items, actually you can TRADE these with POINTS in Nyaronkopon Shop Item. (Pick the Point Trading). 1 Friendship Komainu = 1 Point Trading.
Collect 160 Points and you can get 1 free gachapon ticket to roll nyaronkopon once. Or you can collect 50 points to get Great Smelting Amulet Fortune

2.Lucky Amulets (Smelting, Crafting, Reset Button)
Smelting 10%, 20% and 30% = Increase the smelting success rate%, very useful when you want to smelt weapons up from +50 to +60 and above.
Crafting = Increase the crafting success rate%, not very useful since the base success rate is already high, but to be safe, this can be used. Or exchange this item for 5 Points.
Reset Button = If your smelting fails, this item (rather usefully) will save your weapon not to break. (though, still get the lower durability)

3.Skill Cards Set(IV,V,VI,VII)
This one is very useful Skill card sets (Rather than buying, you can one yourself !). Actually cyberstep is very generous I think about this one. There are many skill sets, around 4 I think which contain many different skills. For example, you can get Healing IV (for staff), Hellfire VII (for wand), Sanctuary IV, Holly Pillar IV, Tornado V, Lunge Steps, Water Dragon Spear, Peacock Arrows, etc..

4.Cudgels Weapons
Enhance : This one can be used to GREATLY enhance your weapons, with minimum expense/ryous. I tried using this for 816 ryous, I can enhance +40 to +50 weapon lv.20 with one click/step.
Smelting : Can be used to subsitute 'sacrifice' weapon. Very useful, if you want to smelt 'rare'/ hard to CRAFT weapons because of the ingredients.

5.Potions
These potions.. for me it's not very useful, can't be exchanged for points it seems. You need to setting these potions into shortcut first before use in dungeon. You can heal up to 1k-2k HP and around you. Useful in pinch. (Hi-Potions and Mega Potions).

========

If you're very diligent, you can farm lucky boxes and get around 50-60 lucky boxes a day, hunt monsters max 9 lv. below/above you to maximize the drops. It means, you can roll nyaronkopon once every three days. In one month you can get around 10 additional gacha tickets besides finishing the main quest. Just remember, you need to kill the mobs :twisted: :D :D .

=======

meep wrote:Well Ozzy you are positive and I like you
Jesus :D

I like you both. You have a point.
ozzy = oozing out, slimes? :o :lol: , feels like an ooze
IGN : Lynneth (lv.92/Reraised as Zombies) - Looking for more exciting experience..Rather than being depressed, better just play! :D. Let's grind for teamwork.. or not? :P :). Looking for party to grind lv.90+ weapon. Whisp me IGN!-In hiatus for 2 days-
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Re: Fix the Healer Class

Postby Hisashiburi » 28 Jul 2014, 23:53

meep wrote:Player skills aside, the only requirement to being support is having a staff


That's why i called it "fake".
Seeing your main weapon is bow/spear, but with just only 1 staff with invigorate/idaten, you're free to leeching wherever you want.
Different case if staff is not your main job, but you have rapid storm/meditation/extend heal on that staff. Congratulation, you already sacrifice that precious ougi card to staff even though you're not pure support, you're not fake anymore.
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Re: Fix the Healer Class

Postby Lynneth » 28 Jul 2014, 23:57

Hisashiburi wrote:
meep wrote:Player skills aside, the only requirement to being support is having a staff


That's why i called it "fake".
Seeing your main weapon is bow/spear, but with just only 1 staff with invigorate/idaten, you're free to leeching wherever you want.
Different case if staff is not your main job, but you have rapid storm/meditation/extend heal on that staff. Congratulation, you already sacrifice that precious ougi card to staff even though you're not pure support, you're not fake anymore.


So being support is totally easy, just put some staff on and have rapid storm/meditation and extend heal :lol: .. and perhaps pump up some MIND stats .. and one more, being selfless... which is not easy :? :?
IGN : Lynneth (lv.92/Reraised as Zombies) - Looking for more exciting experience..Rather than being depressed, better just play! :D. Let's grind for teamwork.. or not? :P :). Looking for party to grind lv.90+ weapon. Whisp me IGN!-In hiatus for 2 days-
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Re: Fix the Healer Class

Postby meep » 29 Jul 2014, 00:12

Hisashiburi wrote:
meep wrote:Player skills aside, the only requirement to being support is having a staff


That's why i called it "fake".
Seeing your main weapon is bow/spear, but with just only 1 staff with invigorate/idaten, you're free to leeching wherever you want.
Different case if staff is not your main job, but you have rapid storm/meditation/extend heal on that staff. Congratulation, you already sacrifice that precious ougi card to staff even though you're not pure support, you're not fake anymore.

Don't conveniently cut quote.

By your standards anyone not up to the job, regardless of weapon is to be considered fake
Hybrids? Fake
Spear that can't one shot a crowd of mobs? Fake
Rest of the melee weapons compared to spears? Fake

I understand clearly now.
Effort is a gesture, results are everything, now all will worship only the elite
Life lesson learned. Lol.
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