Onigiri's Sustainability - An Analysis of Playerbase Decline

[Ryxa]

Well..you sound like it....

And between all the typing and checking I didn't have time to check that just yet..
I'm not for multitasking during typings..

Anyways..it wasn't meant as an insult..

I know perfectly good mods on many other forums..

That's likely because I've moderated other forums in the past. And even if it was not an insult, I think it's important to clear that up before someone starts misunerstanding.

And UGH..way too much stuff to read every time..

They oughta make forums a lil better organizerable..

I won't be back soon to read replies..cuz I can only take so much reading per diem..

Have a nice grindy day (and I mean dungeon grinding instead of ident+sorting+etc grinding..YUCk..)

I think Rhythm is going to respond to you at least once more.

[ZMacZ]

Well..you sound like it....

And between all the typing and checking I didn't have time to check that just yet..
I'm not for multitasking during typings..

Anyways..it wasn't meant as an insult..

I know perfectly good mods on many other forums..

And UGH..way too much stuff to read every time..

They oughta make forums a lil better organizerable..

I won't be back soon to read replies..cuz I can only take so much reading per diem..

Have a nice grindy day (and I mean dungeon grinding instead of ident+sorting+etc grinding..YUCk..)

[SupremeTentacle]

A large scale map (where you can see all areas at once, so you can find stuff better..)

Press "M". If you mean a map that crosses through the entire game, it's not necessary. You're basically forced down a line since the maps are not truely open-world and the game is almost entirely instance based. You'll memorize all of it soon enough.

I meant like a map that can show the entire game world, with stuff like dungeons that you may or may not yet have finished..like a lil more comprehensive..it doesn't have to fit right next to each other..and it doesn't have to fit on one screen..

I get where you're coming from, but the amount of work for a very minor quality of life update that like 10 people ever would use... not sure if worth.

- The markets need to be able to sell for ingame gold, as well as C's..
(And FYI, thanx for letting ppl know in advance that you actually CAN't....but wait..you don't do that..so I consider my $9 SOO overspent)

You can make a free stall. If you purchased a stall without trying out the free version they gave you, that is sort of your fault.

Not really..it didn't show..period..and that remains my opinion...
Note:If you can make a free one than why would I wanna buy one if I had known that ? Specialy if I would have know that you can't sell anything for Ryou ? Spend C's in order to make a smaller amount of C's in return makes no sense FYI..

The free one has different capabilities for the one you pay for.


- Extending the lock on for when you can't see a player, since it's hard to make out who is who in furball..making support kinda hard..

Already addressed.

But hardly solved...I can't support on hard grinding when the view is filled with ppl..

Already addressed means that its already been mentioned. The targeting system is indeed horrible and needs a rework.

- preloading capability for the better systems (if ur near an exit already start loading what's behind the door...long load times..boring..)
(I consider anything above 5 secs LONG..)

Imagine if you took all your load screens and added it into one. Now imagine if the game also began to run really slowly because you loaded every resource in a single dungeon at once.

Oh plz..get a programming manual..You don't have to load EVERYTHING at once..just designate certain areas as a border to start preloading the content that is needed for the portal that is near..(background)...if the area is left again, simply cancel the preload..

This game is, unfortunately, horribly unoptimized. If you happen to kill stuff while the game is attempting to load files, and you're computer isn't $1k+, you'll end up lagging like shit and decreasing the overall quality of life. I believe that the majority of players would rather wait a few seconds at a loading screen than deal with constant FPS lag due to preloading - especially when you have to go through a portal anyways. As your computer requires 5 seconds to load, preloading would likely drop your fps to something in the 10's if you were also attacking a mob at the same time.

In terms of programming, I believe that it's actually quite a pain, as the developers would have to go back through each map and identify the coordinates. (This might not be nessecary for going into portals as they could simply determine whether a player came into contact with a portal type object).

Besides, what if a player was grinding near a portal? Then they would be constantly preloading and then cancelling the preload, leading to them lagging more unless it loads everything within a set distance, which would just lead to an overall laggy, obnoxious experience.

- permanent upgrades of carry/inventory, both in size and number...like repeatable carry option..4x25 for maximum of 200 inventory..
and 4x50 upgrades for max stack size (max 300)..less time running back and forth...no getting tired from it too..

Max storage size upgrades do exist. Your inventory size AND storage size increases as you level up Shizuka. Max stacks isn't a bad idea but isn't needed since you can put everything into storage with 999 stack max.

Hmm....well..it could be bigger (the inventory...)

Level up Shizuka. I have 270 slots at the moment, not counting premium.

- allowing for stacking of crafting/smelting success rate items..(I hate having done 2 hrs of work, to get gold for smeltings getting POOFED in a single shot..)

Trust me, this game would be even closer to pay to win if this was implemented, especially since end tier weapons would be hilariously easy to accomplish.

Well..that's your opinion..if people would rather spend $10 than 100% useless grinding for more gold..that's THEIR business or not ?

At the moment, the most expensive possible smelt in the game is around 14.5m base. Assuming you use the two most expensive possible artisan options, this raises the price to around 43.5m. This is equivalent to under 2 hours of farming in kyoto, which is a moderately low level area. (~Lv. 2x-5x dungeons, where the cap is 115).

Okay sure, you'd rather invest money than this time, it's understandable. But when you take into account the way by which the smelting works in this game, it becomes utterly unreasonable. You literally add 30% success rate, as opposed to multiplying the base success rate by 1.3. This would allow you to reach 85% success rate on the final smelt, which is honestly stupidly broken. This would also reduce the rate of weapon loss to a mere 7.5%.

I'd only agree with you if the success rate was multiplicative, leaving you at 20% * 1.65 = 33%. Of course, this is not only worse than the current system, but also leads to a risk of losing your item. Compared to the ways in which other games work, this weapon enhancement system feels generous, since you can already get 55% on the final upgrade, as well as completely prevent the weapon's loss.

- allowing for more stuffles being sellable...the stuff you can buy right now (or sell) is kinda..meager ?..(compared to what all items there are..)

Such as what items?

Simply put..(next to) everything ? Some people like to grind for stuffs..some other's hate grindings for specifics..
ATM..the people that like to grind have no use for the stuff..and others who DON'T like to grind for specifics can't buy..
I don't understand how you've arrived at this conclusion. You can easily buy an item that you want from another player if you do not wish to grind for it. There are players who actually sit around in town asking if anyone would like to employ them to farm something.

- allow gifting of C's when being bought for some else..(When buying C's you get the option to fill in someone's name..)

If you trust someone enough to buy them game currency, they should at least trust you enough to change their password for a few minutes so you can log in to their account and buy the currency there. Alternatively, use Paypal.

A workaround is not an implementation..and the 'sharing' of passwords is SUCH A BAWD IDEA..
I believe the point that was made here was: "Why would you give someone you don't trust money?"

Though, I do understand your point that sharing passwords is not a great idea.

- regular timed WB's...with caste system..(L1-25, L26-50, L51+..)

Wouldn't work with the way the game is designed. They'd have to implement some sort of level restriction into their instance portals which I'm not sure is possible without a lot of work. Closest you're going to get are the boss spawn events which become huge mosh pits where players under level 100ish are pretty much useless if they try to cater to the higher levels and if they try to cater to the lower levels the bosses die instantly.

Once again..grab a programming manual..you can shift ppl's entry into an instance by using an item system...
You write the ticket..it says 1<LEVEL<25 then usable..26<LEVEL<50 then usable..etc..
Upon use..enter the specific instance..

Doesn't work unless they agree to change the exp and ryou reward system from killing monsters.

- cheap teleport tickets or something like that...maybe for ingame gold...if someone wants to come for aid..and you wanna find them quickly instead of having to walk there..(removal of boring stuff...10 minutes less travel/loading = 10 minutes more of actual play...)

Use the temporal rift.

Not NEARLY close to fast enough.....

Exactly how is this not nearly fast enough? I can get to any map in the game in like 2 minutes or less, with the longest travel time being in edo since its split into three towns.

- private meeting place..selectable/and/or buildable..would be nice...you can even actually SELL places..like a beach or something with dolphins and stuff..maybe combine it with player created content being chosen from players that would like to create a landscape or stuffs like that...but that's kinda beyond the scope of the current game...(but hey..wouldn't it be nice ?..."ur beach or mine ?..".. : D

Please. Don't cyber. Although it'd be nice to have somewhere players can just sit and gather, rift and the major towns (Echigo in particular) serve this purpose already.

Cyber ?...alright..I consider this comment a flame..I meant a player made private place where it's nice and quiet to hang....
You buy stuff from the shop..you put it in..down to the scenery....assign friends who can enter or simply make it for all friends..
Or by invite to friends only...if ur not friends you can't come in..vice versa..if ur not friends you can't be invited...
Why don't you just use a chat group? It's literally what you mentioned but without physical form.

- try and make ur interface a lil more friendly..it kinda sucks as is..specially the chat..that keeps you in there while you actually wanna say something just quickly and continue onward..(instead you get "wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww" and "dddddddddddddddddddddd"..)
(here's how most mmorpg's have it..press enter once, type line, end with enter..and ur out again...also..changing channels when talking....the /s /p /w are almost ok..(/w oughta stay the same target unless there's change)...but the fact that the chat window also changes instead of staying in general..this could also be solved by adding the two letter option..../ss /ps /ws....that would make the chat window make display the same window as before, while changing the channel you talk into in general, party or whisper..)
(This could be built upon by using that in every case..../ss (talk in general and display it)../ww...(talk in whisper and only display it)../pp (talk party and display it..).../ps..(go to party but still display general..cuz that way you can still read what's being said by other ppl..)
And on this same topic..SHORTCUTS !!..specially for weapon changes..

Press enter twice instead of once. Not really that hard. You learn new habits for each game you play anyways. As for the chat window changing... I'm not even sure what yo're going on about here. As for weapon changing... press f, drag mouse, release f. It's not difficult and 1-5 as well as f1-f5 are all used.

Well I prefer a key for changing weapons so I won't have to stop dodging while changing weapons..and try that while holding F....
And on the chat..what ur saying means "change urself..."...and that's rude..
Changing yourself is one of the most basic things individuals learn as members of society.

- that incessant "Next" button in the Identify window and up the limit to like 50...
(Grinding is already pretty repetitive..but on top of that..pressing and filling that Identify stuff..BORING..REMOVE..ASAP..)
If you wanna keep ppl happy so that they keep playing and paying..well..remove the repetitiveness of stuff you REALLy don't wanna spend time doing....in general...If it were up to me I'd have an Identify BRONZE/SILVER/GOLD/ALL button...but hey..that's me..)
Also..the info..SO not interesting at the time..do you really think people are watching that stuff ?..come on..REMOVE PWEEEASE..)

We've asked about some sort of mass identification multiple times. Based on how the game seems to work... if you ID too many at once you'd likely crash your game. That's probably why it's set up like that.

Are you kidding ?...what kinda logic is that ?....removal of the "NEXT" button would crash the game ?..LOL..than that needs a big fat BUG FIX....not me needing to change my mind about needing to click that..
Wait..lemme clarify..what's the diff in the game..me clicking the next button really fast...or it simply going on on it's own..
I know there's certain limitation to a computer system and/or servers..but..if it would make the game crash client side because it can't handle that many changes in the inventory at once..you can still automate it..instead of trying to do it all at once..youc an still increase the number and treat each ident as a new request to the server as a seperate one..granted..that would not be as fast as computing it all at once..but still..significantly less time consuming...
(The simplest way to implement that is the have the client treat larger batches as separate batches of up to 20..which is possible right now as is..so..when you wanna try and ident 100 pieces..you internally treat them as 5 batches of 20..and the click button..well..can click itself...to put it simple..)
In the past, we were allowed to flood the chatbox to an extent using a certain glitch. Because of the way that this game was programmed, it would basically end up crashing players because the game attempted to write into memory outside of the pre-defined array size.

Furthermore, this game does not appear to have a free() function for memory that is already allocated. Every time you click next, every time you open a menu, or load a list, you are using up some of the limited memory that this game has. Once you reach the max, it has a C++ error and crashes. Based on observation, a new list is created every time a member is taken off a list (note this may be incorrect), and hence, it ends up eating up your memory even faster, which means that yes, you identifying 50 things and mashing the next button will lead to a faster crash than a lesser amount of identifications.



- the 'tax' on the C items being sold by player markets...(If you wanna come across like beancounters..well..that's THE way..)
people wanna buy stuff from the shop with their C's....so they'll drop anyway.... (you CAN tax the selling of gold though...)

Be glad the tax is 30% and not 50% like it used to be. Same with the minimum price thing. Min price has been dropped multiple times. As for Ryou based trading... not sure that'll happen.

Well..you can agree with that policy all you want..that won't change my mind..and the Ryou trading..well..let's just say that people won't wanna trade..for C's in certain cases..which leaves one option..grinding urself...
And all that may be good and well..but like I said..if you wanna keep the players coming instead of leaving..COMPLY INSTEAD....
I agree. The tax rate is too high, but at the same time, it appears that the developers are already working on it. Minimum prices were literally just decreased yesterday in the japanese server.

Except for this..don't try to come across as greedy...hand out some USEFULL stuff once every while...the free gacha's are not cutting it...(mostly since you don't get what you'd like with them..) Most games have a free Cash program..like 1C per login day....well you get the picture...

Go to Charge Onigiri Coins -> Free offers. Watch video. Earn 1 OC.

Omg..you never heard of the word 'giving' have you ?..besides..i already bought C...it's about trying to keep or even expand the player base..btw..that would be neat wouldn't it ?..customer says I wunz..you says..get this instead..if economics would only work that way..
(try an economics study....specially the one with the nay's and yay's..)
There's very limited games that give you free "cash" directly. Almost every single company has free offers for people who don't want to pay; I fail to see your point here. If you try to look at this from an economics stand point, they literally have infinite supply so its completely dependent on demand. Furthermore, you need to consider the fact that its completely elastic.

Oh wait..one more thing..try and add a lil new content..that would be especially nice for the really old players, but also..no matter how good the food..if it's the same food each and every day for years and years, then even the best of the best foods lose their taste..

They have been adding content and pretty fast about it compared to some other MMOs I can name.

Ok...that I'll believe..but you think narrow..new content does not necessary mean more monsters or areas...
(It's about increasing keeping player base..)

..LATERZ

On a side note... your forum account was created about four hours ago. Try to play a game for more than just ONE day before you comment on it. First impressions are important and all, but they're not all that makes up a game. Also, if you looked through the thread and saw the preview (Which is now outdated) of what we were putting together, nearly every issue you brought up is already being addressed.

On my note..I been playing this game for almost a week now..and yes..I made a forum account only hours ago..
Does that mean I'm new to this genre ? NO..
Does that mean I don't know what I'm talking about ? NO..
Does that mean even if I were an utter noob to everything I would not be allowed to say anything ? NO..

Pretty sure that if you really wanted to help the game you would have read more instead of aggravating others.

Simple..if you wanna stay a mod on any forum..you gotta have thicker hide....
One positive note...You actual read it..and posted replies to each point..that is admirable..although...they could be a lil more constructive..or at least sounding so abrupt..

Always keep in mind..some of the people that post stuff or even ask stupid stuff on this forum are paying customers..
So..a modicum of restraint would go a long way..even if it's sole purpose would be to make ppl feel welcome....

(simple analogy..if you enter that cafe again..and the waiter says "WHADDAYA WANT ?!?"...or he says "Can I take your order plz ?.."
in simple ceteris paribus equation..which would work best ?....)
In terms of the service industry, there is no ceteris paribus. You CANNOT hold all else equal simply because every customer has their own unique tastes, as evidenced by the fact there are indeed some successful stores in which the owner will take your order with a ""WHADDAYA WAND?!?"
..


Note: If thsi comes out all unintelligible..spending over 15 minutes just doing the format..UGH....sowwies....

All done i think..except for the typos...well..

Yes, I'm annoyed.

[OPPAI]

Why do you guys even bother replying him..

Just giving my 10 cents..and nope..not gonna read 15 pages of replies..nty..I'd rather be playing....

This already shows how much he's someone not worth listening to.

"BLEH IM NOT GONNA UNDERSTAND THE SITUATION BUT IM GONNA TALK SHIT ANYWAY WHAT AM I TALKING ABOUT"

[Ryxa]

We've finished a good bunch of the document. All that's remaining is our opinions regarding balancing, which might take a while to put into words. Here's a link to the new thread I made about it.

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=4983

[MyName1991]

*Skip from Page 9*
Coming for a new player (no main, 4+ day old), game is becoming boring... & repetitive...
Too Skill spamming, Skill rank dependent, OP weapon grade & + dependent, unbalance weapon skills, lack of creativity, too much grind.

As said from previous post, Spear is OP... (WDS) while other weapons with small hit radius (like axe) have low damage to SP.
Players will rush XXXXX Hell (not 'XXX') while spamming skills from various weapons, (cast skill > switch to next weapon > cast similar skill)
example: 2 to 4 spear with each VI++ WDS.

OP skills will remain OP... Most Ougi-users will use Ougi when have the available SP to use. not other normal skills.
Example: Use Ougi sth sth than Poison Fang.

Weapon with Grade 100 & +100 will always be OP... especially being crafted by his/her main char of level 100+.
The weapon of similar type grade 3x + 10 or 20 will be weaker than the above, right?

Press 1 ~ 5 to select skill, & right mouse button to cast is just dumb... why not cast skill on pressing 1~5? With this, the right mouse button if free for some other new weapon type feature...

Really grind...

Suggestion:
-to reduce skill spamming, Increase all Skill SP cost, while increasing their damage multiplier.
-to prevent players from switch weapon to skip skill CD, implement a system where, players hitting (normals) with the current weapon will gain damage boost in % on their next skill cast or for a number of cast. dmg boost effect disappear when switch to another weapon.
-lock & slowly raise the limit of obtainable & usable Grade and available +enhancement as player' level increase. (unable to use Grade & Enhancement of too high even if in inventory)
-Right mouse button function with casting skill on skill selection, For example, AXE with this feature can do some sort of charged attack by holding down right mouse button, high base damage & multiplier while consuming high duration & it's slow. and since it's not a skill, this shld not use any SP or have CD.
-increase exp rate for dungeon run...

[Firon]

*Skip from Page 9*
Coming for a new player (no main, 4+ day old), game is becoming boring... & repetitive...
Too Skill spamming, Skill rank dependent, OP weapon grade & + dependent, unbalance weapon skills, lack of creativity, too much grind.

As said from previous post, Spear is OP... (WDS) while other weapons with small hit radius (like axe) have low damage to SP.
Players will rush XXXXX Hell (not 'XXX') while spamming skills from various weapons, (cast skill > switch to next weapon > cast similar skill)
example: 2 to 4 spear with each VI++ WDS.

I don't think they'll change wds because that would be like changing chian... oh wait XD
(new player so may not know, chian (chiami) was changed because it was "too OP" and changed back a day later because of complaints)

OP skills will remain OP... Most Ougi-users will use Ougi when have the available SP to use. not other normal skills.
Example: Use Ougi sth sth than Poison Fang.

Ougi generally use a lot of durability -.-", I guess it depends on the weapon. Yeah, I also use ougi a lot because the gap between tb, tsb and normal skills for aoe and dmg is huge for ts. The number of good weapons I have=the number of ougi cards I have/2 XD.

Weapon with Grade 100 & +100 will always be OP... especially being crafted by his/her main char of level 100+.
The weapon of similar type grade 3x + 10 or 20 will be weaker than the above, right?

Yes... this adds value to weapons so I don't think it should be changed. Early on, it doesn't make much difference, though, since base attack values are small and aff plays a much bigger factor and later on, you really should be smelting high +'s.

Press 1 ~ 5 to select skill, & right mouse button to cast is just dumb... why not cast skill on pressing 1~5? With this, the right mouse button if free for some other new weapon type feature...

Useful imo, can select a skill without casting and q scroll through them.

Really grind...

ikr.

Suggestion:
-to reduce skill spamming, Increase all Skill SP cost, while increasing their damage multiplier.
-to prevent players from switch weapon to skip skill CD, implement a system where, players hitting (normals) with the current weapon will gain damage boost in % on their next skill cast or for a number of cast. dmg boost effect disappear when switch to another weapon.
-lock & slowly raise the limit of obtainable & usable Grade and available +enhancement as player' level increase. (unable to use Grade & Enhancement of too high even if in inventory)
-Right mouse button function with casting skill on skill selection, For example, AXE with this feature can do some sort of charged attack by holding down right mouse button, high base damage & multiplier while consuming high duration & it's slow. and since it's not a skill, this shld not use any SP or have CD.
-increase exp rate for dungeon run...

-First suggestion would increase dependency on invig and sp pots but I don't think it would lessen skill spamming unless passive sp regen (and rate) was increased or something...
-Oh, interesting... I think the game would need more skills available first, though, or at least to make skills more similar in aoe and dmg so there wouldn't be so much dependency on those certain skills in question.
-Hmm, if this was implemented you should be able to decrease the grade or enhancement (but tbh, grade doesn't play that big a factor early on given that aff plays a much bigger role) so that people would still trade weapons.
-Hard to use on most things... Also, supposedly you're talking about more dmg than chaining 3 skills on a stunned enemy which I can think of a few enemies with would become much easier just by setting yourself up for one hit with lots of dmg rather than having to find the timing for each separate attack.

Analysed it out of habit-oh well, just my opinions :)

edit: Typo -.-"

[MyName1991]

-Hard to use on most things... Also, supposedly you're talking about more dmg than chaining 3 skills on a stunned enemy which I can think of a few enemies with would become much easier just by setting yourself up for one hit with lots of dmg rather than having to find the timing for each separate attack.

Analysed it out of habit-oh well, just my opinions

Was thinking of those feature/function where you'r able to charge up the right mouse attack while moving around. Rolling/blocking/guarding will cancel the charge- progress.

Thought up of some ideas:
-The Holding 'F' and shifting mouse to top/bottom, left, right for different weapon should include different maga-set up as well.
Like for my TOP, i want to have max attack sword, with full sword affinity & skill force.
for my BOTTOM, i want max attack affinity & skill force for axe.
switching from top to bottom, should switch my max sword affinity & skill to axe affinity & skill.
Basically, different maga-set up to go along with the different equipped weapon (Holding 'F' function)

[SupremeTentacle]

Thought up of some ideas:
-The Holding 'F' and shifting mouse to top/bottom, left, right for different weapon should include different maga-set up as well.
Like for my TOP, i want to have max attack sword, with full sword affinity & skill force.
for my BOTTOM, i want max attack affinity & skill force for axe.
switching from top to bottom, should switch my max sword affinity & skill to axe affinity & skill.
Basically, different maga-set up to go along with the different equipped weapon (Holding 'F' function)

Please try to consider the balance implications of what you state.

It makes it rather difficult to consider the rest of the post(s) to be reasonably thought out and valid.

[-x-SongNhi-x-]

-Hard to use on most things... Also, supposedly you're talking about more dmg than chaining 3 skills on a stunned enemy which I can think of a few enemies with would become much easier just by setting yourself up for one hit with lots of dmg rather than having to find the timing for each separate attack.

Analysed it out of habit-oh well, just my opinions

Was thinking of those feature/function where you'r able to charge up the right mouse attack while moving around. Rolling/blocking/guarding will cancel the charge- progress.

Thought up of some ideas:
-The Holding 'F' and shifting mouse to top/bottom, left, right for different weapon should include different maga-set up as well.
Like for my TOP, i want to have max attack sword, with full sword affinity & skill force.
for my BOTTOM, i want max attack affinity & skill force for axe.
switching from top to bottom, should switch my max sword affinity & skill to axe affinity & skill.
Basically, different maga-set up to go along with the different equipped weapon (Holding 'F' function)

No...the whole point of the restrictions and limitations for locking your equipment upon entering is to balance out the classes. If you are able to mix and match magatamas on the fly then everyone will be master of all classes, only difference being is their main stat setup. This should not be changed. The beauty of this game is for players to try and strike that perfect balance if they want to go hybrid they must be smart in the way they sacrifice dmg for utility, if that restriction was removed, everyone would have perfect maga setup for 4 different weapons.

PS. I like the "right-click to activate skill" function as it is quite intuitive, the skills are memorized for each weapon and when u switch it will revert to the last skill used on that particular weapon, it is quite natural and soon becomes 2nd nature actually. I dont want to be spamming the 1-5 keys nonstop while WASD moving/dodging enemies (it can cause unneeded stress/cramps on fingers) especially if the skills i want are already memorized on the 4 different weapons, also sometimes you can select the wrong skill and in this game of onigiri 1 mistake can and mostly will cost you your life as the mobs have abilities and dmg to 1hit ko you. I like the ability to scroll through the different skill with keys and then confirm/activate with my mouse. Only thing I dont like is the block/guard function with regards to the wand/staff (or should i say lack off).